Why Ask a Cardinal When Nuns are Better?
New York's Timothy Cardinal Dolan will give the closing prayer at the Democratic Convention. (Link)
As a (recovering) Catholic, I am deeply offended that this.
As a Democrat, I am appalled at this.
We are talking about the CLOSING STATEMENT of the convention. After all the speeches and hoopla, how incredibly stupid is it to turn the microphone over to a guy who can't stomach what the Democratic Party stands for?
This is what people will walk away with. The Cardinals have no credibility to stand at a Democratic Convention - period. They have activated The Church in favor of the GOP for decades. Part of the reason I left The Church was coming out from Mass on the Sunday morning before any election and having my car littered with political flyers that not only endorsed GOP Candidate after GOP Candidate, but spread falsehoods against Democrats. Forget about the separation of Church and State, they let the lies be spread.
The role of the Cardinals and The Church in covering up pedophilia in the ranks of the clergy should be looked at as a third rail in political politics. Finally, convictions have been made in the scandal, but not before the large thicket of legal maneuvering that would sometimes run the clock out on victims. The Cardinals had an active role in defending these creeps. Does the Democratic Party want to be associated with that?
As the GOP wants to be the Rape Definition Party, fine let them. Allowing the Cardinal to speak to the Democratic Convention is diluting the power of this issue. The Democrats are giving "No Abortion At Any Time" issue a huge boost in credibility by letting this guy speak.
If the Democratic Party believes in fully funding Public Education, what are they doing giving the microphone to the guy who's economic endeavors most benefits the destruction of public education? Remember the biggest proponent of school vouchers may be The Catholic School System. They need that infusion of tax payer cash to keep their alternate schools open. They cannot make it in the marketplace without this government handout. (Isn't that money is coming from Public Education?)
I wonder if the leaders of the Democratic Party feel that there is some legitimacy in having this prelate speak? Without a better knowledge of the Catholics (current and recovering) who are Democrats, the Democratic leaders are working against a sizable population of Catholics who feel the corporatist version of Catholicism preached by the Cardinals is wrong.
Catholics are not a monolith. The Democrats who extended this invitation have unintentionally insulted a large number of their own congregation. There is a split in The Church. Tons of us have left The Church. Just ask why so many churches and schools are closing. The Democrats who extended this invitation are hurting those who remain in The Church who may want to stand up to these bullies.
The Democratic Party can help give some aid and comfort to those who don't buy into the Corporate-Politico Catholcismby rescinding this invitation and giving it to The Nuns on the Bus. These women are the ones who are exhibiting the values of the Catholicism that was taught by Jesus. The Nuns on the Bus need to be armed with the clickers and rulers to get the clergy in line. There is no reason why the Nuns on the Bus cannot deliver the prayer.
The Nuns represent the gender equality issue within The Church. When living what Christ has taught them, they are showing the world that Catholics are not all towing the Papal line. These Catholics are putting Christ first. Put the Nuns on the Bus up there and people can walk out of the convention feeling good about what they are about to do.
If the leaders of the Democratic Party cannot bring themselves to rescind this invitation, then I would ask all the Delegates to stay for the Cardinal's Prayer and when he gets up to speak, quietly stand and turn around with your back to him. It is a silent and effective protest that should make him realize the brand of Christianity he is selling is not compatible with being an American.
The Nuns on the Bus need the exposure.
The Cardinals do not.
James
6:24 pm on Saturday, September 1, 2012
Dolan, really?
Was David Duke unavailable?
Mike Shortall
10:11 pm on Saturday, September 1, 2012
I agree. What were the Champions of Separation thinking?!?
Joe The Nerd Ferraro
10:38 pm on Saturday, September 1, 2012
Mike - I am not asking for full separation. The Nuns have more cred than the Cardinals.
Mohandus Frieri
9:31 am on Sunday, September 2, 2012
You seem to forget Father Robert Drinan, Catholic priest and elected member of the House of Representatives who opposed the Vietnam War and who was pro choice.
You see we have this thing in this country called Freedom of Speech. It applies to Catholics and oddly enough Cardinals. There has never been a time when anyone has pitched the phony arguments than today's Republicans.
Why do the Republicans pitch these arguments? Because they lack any credibility or morality whatsoever. Voter suppression, election rigging, lying, distorting, obstruction and sniping.
You might try listening to someone other than yourselves.
Joe The Nerd Ferraro
11:28 am on Sunday, September 2, 2012
Father Robert Drinan is not a Cardinal.
As I recall, Father Drinan took a lot of heat from his higher-ups on how he voted.
Seamstressguild
12:23 pm on Sunday, September 2, 2012
He's going to be the Democrats' Eastwood.
William DeAngelis
1:16 pm on Sunday, September 2, 2012
Let's hope that the diversity that is the Democrats, shows itself through Cardinal Dolan. But I hope that Cardinal Dolan doesn't place himself in a position of jeopardy with the Catholic Church because he accepted the honor of providing the closing prayer that will be considered by some as being an imprimatur to what has gone on before.
Joe The Nerd Ferraro
1:01 pm on Monday, September 3, 2012
it becomes a muddled message at best.
Rita Smith, M.E.V.
11:03 am on Monday, September 3, 2012
It is a great act of faith to enter the lion's den. Let's all pray for all our clergy "that they will be Wise and Faithful Shepherds as God calls them to be."
A very good insight on Cardinal Dolan praying at the Democratic National Convention:
http://www.catholicculture.org/commentary/otc.cfm?id=999
Joe The Nerd Ferraro
1:07 pm on Monday, September 3, 2012
The author himself is in the tank for the GOP - calling what the Democrats are about immoral.
He is making my case.
As far as the lion's den? I would venture to say the values exhibited by the Democratic Party are more Christian than what the GOP wants to do.
The GOP wants to use Man's Laws to enforce their version of God's Law.
If we want to have a Theocracy, I guess that is OK, but we have a country that everyone's faith gets a shot.
Stan Chaz
6:46 am on Wednesday, September 5, 2012
Let’s face it: Cardinal Dolan is a Prince of the Church who wants to be King-maker.
But as the good Cardinal parades under the spotlights of the political conventions,
I’d like to humbly remind him that there is room for only ONE real super-star in his religion.
And that is the one who started it.
For as the Cardinal addressed and blessed the Republicans and their billionaire buddies,
as he smiled upon those who would destroy Social Security & voucher Medicare to death,
and as he struted on the stage with those who readily admit they “don’t care about the very poor”
......it would have been good for Cardinal Dolan to stop, to remember, and to take to heart the words of his boss, who once said “Whatsoever you do for the least of these - you do for me”.
Unless perhaps, ...just perhaps, the Cardinal is working for someone else these days? Just asking.
Our Founding Fathers wisely realized that politics, secular power, and religion do not mix.
That they bring out the worst in each other , and that ultimately they would destroy each other, and us.
A pastor should stick to his pulpit, not political conventions. Period.
Bill
1:45 am on Thursday, September 6, 2012
In 1952 President Truman established one day a year as a "National Day of Prayer."
In 1988 President Reagan designated the First Thursday in May of each year as the National Day of Prayer.
In June 2007 (then) Presidential Candidate Barack Obama declared that the USA "Was no longer a
Christian nation."
This year President Obama canceled the 21st annual National Day of Prayer ceremony at the White
House under the ruse Of "not wanting to offend anyone"
BUT...
on September 25, 2009 from 4 AM until 7 PM, a
National Day of Prayer FOR THE MUSLIM RELIGION
was Held on Capitol Hill, Beside the White House.
There were over 50,000 Muslims in D.C. that day.
HE PRAYS WITH THE MUSLIMS!
guess it Doesn't matter if "Christians" Are offended by this event -
We obviously Don't count as "anyone" Anymore.
The direction this country is headed should
strike fear in the heart of every Christian,
especially knowing that the Muslim
religion believes that if Christians cannot
be converted, they should be annihilated.
This is not a Rumor - Go to the website To
confirm this info:
http://www.islamoncapitolhill.com
Bill
2:03 am on Thursday, September 6, 2012
Obama rejects Catholic invocation at DNC, but EVOLVED to accept the good Cardinal.
DNC approves Jumah for 20,000 Muslims.
President Barack Hussein Obama has turned down the chance to have the leading Catholic official in the United States, Timothy Cardinal Dolan pray during the Democratic National Convention. On the other hand, the Democratic National Convention is hosting a Jumah prayer event expected to attract 20,000 Muslims.
President Obama and the Democratic National Convention's bias favoring Islam over Catholicism is alarming. The 2012 Democratic National Convention will take place in Charlotte, North Carolina, from Tuesday, September 4th to Thursday, September 6th.
The Washington Times reports that 20,000 Muslims will gather for “Jumah at DNC” lead by radical Imam Siraj Wahhaj
“The Democratic National Convention is endorsing a political platform for the organizers of a program called the “Jumah at the DNC.” It begins with a jummah prayer on Friday, August 31 and ends on September 2,
Joe The Nerd Ferraro
12:03 pm on Thursday, September 6, 2012
Bill,
you are quite the Ranter!
how about you check out the Snopes on this...
http://www.snopes.com/politics/religion/dncprayer.asp
I think the big word inthe middle of the screen is FALSE.
Bill
2:05 am on Thursday, September 6, 2012
On the surface it appears that the event, organized by the Bureau of Indigenous Muslim Affairs (BIMA), is cultural fun for the whole family whose only political focus is Muslims’ right to assembly, but it is much more than that.
The DNC lists the assembly as an “official function” and claims that the leaders of the program are typical of the DNC community. The group is hardly “mainstream,” being represented by Siraj Wahhaj, who will be the “Grand Imam” for the gathering.”
Here's what the Washington Times reports about Imam Siraj Wahhaj.
At a solidarity speech in 1995, Wahhaj informed the world that it was his “duty and our duty as Muslims to replace the U.S. Constitution with the Quran.”
On another occasion Wahhaj commented, “if only Muslims were clever politically, they could take over the United States and replace its constitutional government with a caliphate.”
At another time he warned the United States that it is doomed to fall unless it “accepts the Islamic agenda.”
And finally, this: “You know what this country (USA) is? It’s a garbage can. It’s filthy.”
Moderate? You be the judge. And his appearance in Charlotte is endorsed by the DNC.
What is so disheartening about the so-called “Jumah at the DNC” is that it has thus far gone unnoticed or ignored by the mainstream press.
Read more that the Washington times.com
Bill
3:19 am on Thursday, September 6, 2012
A Cardinal’s only responsibility is to keep the flock together. Even the far left Marxist sheep. Even the sheep who don’t know about God or think they do and separate from the flock. They are trying to divide the Church. It stands in the way of their plans as it has in the past for other countries. Poland, Russia, and China or anywhere tyranny has roared it’s evil head. So, the “war on women”, and the fines ($100 per day for every employee of every Catholic Institution) if they don’t pay for abortions. It will shut down every hospital, adoption agency, food distribution center, school, and every other Christian agency that can’t moral promote killing babies. Not just the RC Church but Church that refuses. The “War is on Religious Liberty”. Crush the RC church in America and you will destroy Christianity in America. Dolan is trying to save Christianity, ney America.
Joe The Nerd Ferraro
12:11 pm on Thursday, September 6, 2012
i think you are full of BAAAAA-Shit.
Dolan is just as much a political animal as the rest of them. He wanted to get on the dias of the DNC so he would have a fig leaf to say he is not partisan.
As far as dividing the Church - it should be divided.
The Church, as all faiths, are here because our constitution was written that one religion would not dominate over all others.
If you want a theocracy - please move somewhere else.
The RC Church should have the same shot at the public as the Jews, Baptists, Muslims, Lutherans, Sikh, and Buddhists.
I can't help it that you hate other faiths.
But I can help stop you when you want to take over the government.
Christ was not about government control.
Remember the Render unto Cesar thing...
Joe The Nerd Ferraro
12:16 pm on Thursday, September 6, 2012
You seem to think that Abortion is evil and all other things spring from it.
How about this.
You have a lack of faith if you are trying to get the government to enforce your religious doctrine on everyone else.
Why not try living your faith so that you create a society that when a woman is in trouble, it is easier for her to make the life choice.
But that would mean fully funding healthcare for everyone.
Everyone would get a good public school education.
You are so far up the butt of the GOP you don't see how they have killed this country.
BTW, if the GOP was dead set against abortion,
They had the whole shooting match from 2001-2007.
Why did they wait until a Black guy was in the White House to do something about it?
Bill
3:19 am on Thursday, September 6, 2012
“As far as BO more Christian”. He gave $350 million to Planned Parenthood to make them PP International. Hillary is withholding money (blackmailing) Christian countries from Aid UNLESS they get a “Women’s Health Abortion Program”. Through that initiative we are subsidizing China’s one child policy. We borrow from china owing 40cents on the dollar to give money back to China to support this crime. To close, remember Senator BO voted for full/late term abortions 4 times. FYI a near full size baby is pulled out legs first. While the head is still inside the mother a hollow stake will be inserted into the base of the skull and shoved up into the brain and suctioned out until the baby is dead.
May God Bless Your Soul
Joe The Nerd Ferraro
12:16 pm on Thursday, September 6, 2012
Thanks !
I am hoping that God is blessing my soul with every word I type.
Joe The Nerd Ferraro
12:36 pm on Thursday, September 6, 2012
Oh Bill -
Are you more into Jesus Christ or Ayn Rand?
Stephen Eickhoff
12:37 pm on Thursday, September 6, 2012
Joe, you really need more facts and less hyperbole in your opinion articles.
First of all, the stupid statement of one GOP candidate does not speak for the entire party. If it did, then we can assume that the Democratic platform is that the wealth must be spread around, anyone who doesn't vote for Obama is racist, the government builds businesses for us, the recession was good because it reduced carbon emissions, millionaires don't create jobs, and the Taliban are not enemies of America.
Second, what does the concept of "separation of church and state" have to do with those flyers? You say they endorsed GOP candidates and spread lies about Democratic candidates. That pretty much sums up flyers for every election-- of course, also including flyers with GOP and Dem in the opposite positions.
Third, the Catholic Church hasn't been "activated for the GOP for decades." With no real substance behind your claim, I'll assume you're extrapolating this conclusion from the fact that several tenets of that church are in alignment with the GOP platform. That confuses cause and effect; the church might support the GOP because the GOP is pro-life, as an example. They're not supporting the GOP, then remaking it in their own image. If they were, then they sure are failing because there are still many Democratic Catholics-- such as the current House minority leader.
Joe The Nerd Ferraro
1:20 pm on Thursday, September 6, 2012
what facts am i missing?
what stupid GOP statement are you referring to - there is a large array.
My point about the flyers is the tacit endorsement of the Catholic Church to the delivery of them on parishioners cars. It could have been stopped with a single word from an authority figure like the Cardinal. If you haven't seen it then you don't know what I am referring to.
Tell me about the Voucher Systems - this is what the Church has been pushing for years. They got it. (My elementary School in Chester is now a Charter School on the grounds of the Church.) Sorry dude, it is a hazy gauze you don't want to look thru.
We are not fully funding the public school system in favor of the private (Catholic) school system via vouchers. What facts do you want?
Stephen Eickhoff
2:09 pm on Thursday, September 6, 2012
I was referring to your "Rape definition" statement. The GOP is not defining rape as part of their party platform.
A "tacit endorsement"? So the church should have had the flyers removed? Sounds like the opposite of a free society. You are like most progressives in that you can't stand to even tolerate opposition. The rest of us get flyers all the time from both parties, usually full of lies (the GOP candidate for supervisor in my township sent out a doozy last year) and we throw them in the trash.
The voucher system doesn't take funds from public schools because the student that would be using those dollars is not in the school. This is simple accounting-- the funds are removed, but so is the expense. In fact, in some of the worst schools in D.C., the voucher actually cost less than the amount to educate that student in the school! Naturally, the program was ended instead of allowing it to fulfill its promise.
Claiming that the church is pushing vouchers with no evidence tells me that you're just basing it on the fact that their schools might benefit. That may be true, but that's just a lead to the next step of actually collecting evidence. After all, you could just as well point to the Dems' opposition of vouchers as being intended to keep as many kids in public schools as possible so that they can indoctrinate the students with their progressive statist beliefs.
Joe The Nerd Ferraro
2:26 pm on Thursday, September 6, 2012
so you want to hive the GOP on the Freudian slip of legitimate Rape...
wow.
keep calling that kettle black man.
Stephen Eickhoff
12:39 pm on Thursday, September 6, 2012
So, your point is that the Nuns on the Bus should have spoken instead. This organization believes in implementing social justice through the government. Now, I thought that you were for the separation of church and state. Which is it? Is it perhaps that you like this concept only when it benefits your causes? Now that would be an interesting, and possibly more succinct article.
Joe The Nerd Ferraro
1:10 pm on Thursday, September 6, 2012
Political Conventions regularly have religious people offer benedictions at the open and close of proceedings. (That is another discussion you seem to want to branch towards.)
I am griping about the choice of the Cardinal as the closing act because he has merged the Catholic Church with the GOP. If you are going to allow someone - anyone - to invite themselves ( as it appears he has ) and give him the mic the person should be moving in the same direction as the group at large.
By the way, did you see Sister Simone speak last night? She did pretty well.
Bill
4:11 pm on Thursday, September 6, 2012
Wow Joey, why all the hate?
I think it is time for you to resign your position with the Patch. You are all about hate, lies, and name calling to represent such a fine enterprise like the Patch.
Really, Joey, Really. Leave with some self respect. It's embarrassing.
Put your pants on and climb out of the basement and go for a walk outside. Wait until the meds wear off and sit down and write the resignation letter.
Peace be with you, Joey
Joe The Nerd Ferraro
5:26 pm on Thursday, September 6, 2012
time for me to do what?
you are just keyboard commando that can't even put his full real name to what he writes.
the word for that is TROLL...
Bill
4:29 pm on Thursday, September 6, 2012
DNC backed off on the Muslim pray gathering. You can see the actual press release at http://factcheck.org/2012/08/muslim-prayer-service-at-the-dnc/
"Jumuh at the DNC 2012" - not in Tampa, but in Charlotte.
DNC just backed off like they backed off on "No God" & "Jerusalem not the capitol of Israel". Did you see it yesterday it was great when they voted so many times.
Oh I quoted from "Read more at the Washington times.com" Another liberal publication.
So that covers the Muslim thing.
Curmudgeon
4:46 pm on Thursday, September 6, 2012
@Bill: He writes a blog, as anyone can. I think he writes so that he can comment on his own writing. Freedom of Speech, brings Freedom of Stupidity. We just have to tolerate it. The best thing is to ignore his next blog. Perhaps he was a customer of the "Bath Salts" ring??
Joe The Nerd Ferraro
5:25 pm on Thursday, September 6, 2012
ohhhh - I am earning a tag team status!
do I get bonus points?
Bill
4:49 pm on Thursday, September 6, 2012
Good advice. "Bath Salts" too funny.
Bill
10:35 am on Friday, September 7, 2012
@ Joe, I apologize.
Yesterday I said some derogatory things and I apologize for them. Sure we have different views, but we should focus on what we have in common as oppose to what divides us. Our country is in serious trouble and a united America can overcome any obstacle. We are Americans and more importantly brothers in Christ let us focus on solutions. Again please forgive me. - Bill
Joe The Nerd Ferraro
12:00 pm on Friday, September 7, 2012
Apology is accepted under the 7x70 rule.
I hope you can appreciate how much more difficult it is to be a Pro-Choice Catholic.
(I wonder if Messianic Jews get the same treatment?)
Just because we don't tow the line that the government and the Church needs to keep their hands off women's bodies, we are ostracized by those in charge of the Church.
Think about it. Cardinal Chaput is the guy who would hold The Body of Christ hostage from Catholics who don't think the way he wants them to.
If you read some of my other stuff - I think you may realize we are closer than you think.